Release Interview


Robert Varga
 

Hello everyone,

I would also like to raise two concerns:

1) this particular conversation is point-to-point and not on mailing
list. I do not see *any* reason for it to be private, so can everyone
here *default* to mailing lists, please?

2) we are slipping more and more into *only* using meetings. There is
very little in terms of asynchronous (and public) communication going on
-- and very quickly 'on meetings' is becoming the only place where any
work is being done.

If you look at LFX, the second trend is clearly visible in graphs when
you look at on which days things tend to happen.

I am not sure what 'interview' is meant to mean here.

Honestly, as the guy who contributed 53% of changes in past 6 months and
83.5% of changes in last 90 days, I just do not have the cycles to
edit/maintain wiki pages -- this is effectively creating reports and as
such it *must* be automated. Any and all maintenance must be a natural
part of the development workflow -- i.e. things like 'which versions are
in Silicon MRI' absolutely must have a single place in Gerrit and that
place needs to be updated as part of the version bump process -- just
like
https://docs.opendaylight.org/projects/integration-distribution/en/latest/platform-versions.html
is.

I have raised the issue of our release notes templates being unusable to
pretty much everyone at least three times over the course of past three
years, yet nothing has changed.

They are useless to developers, simply because things are not tied to
anything developer-tangible. It is unusable to marketing, because it
deals with 'features' and similar technical constructs. It is useless to
our end users, as it is not tied to use cases.

Each and every single release we go through the same exercise and basics
do not change.

Per-project release notes should look something like:
https://www.eclipse.org/xtend/releasenotes.html#/releasenotes/2021/03/02/version-2-25-0
-- note how pretty much everything in that is easily scripted and automated.

The overall SimRel notes should look something like:
https://www.eclipse.org/eclipse/news/4.19/

Both of those should be created in a collaborative and open fashion and
ultimately hosted in a git repository (probably docs).

As for timing, please understand that these documents come to life at
SimRel start and *NOT* just before SimRel is released -- they need to be
*finalized* in the few weeks between code freeze and release
announcement. What that means in concrete terms is that for Silicon
these should have been started on 2020-09-17 at the latest -- and
preferably just after 2020-08-03.

Regards,
Robert

On 25/03/2021 12:04, guillaume.lambert@orange.com wrote:
Hi all

 

Brandon, Casey, I’d be happy to give you my thought but if you really
need them by this Friday, the best I can do is Friday 10pm Paris Time (=
2pm  LA time).

If Robert wants to make the interview, I am also fine with that as long
as the whole TSC is OK.

 

I share Casey’s concern that this topic risks to absorb the whole TSC
meeting.

Daniel, is that fine if we limit this talk to 10 to review the deadlines
and organize ourselves ?.

 

If we did talk about this marketing message a fortnight ago, some
projects did only have one meeting to react since then.

And we have still pending technical issues to fix before broadcasting
any marketing message.

Silicon Managed projects have not been released or approved yet. SM
projects are still working hard to wrap up.

So I can understand some of them have not filled the wiki yet.

 

As a PTL, I’ve raised the topics several times to the TransportPCE
contributors during our syncs but they are all pretty busy.

AT&T contributors were struggling with a bug to prepare their demo for
the OFC conference and Orange was preparing another demo for MDONS.

During this release, Nokia and Eurecom also proposed additional
interesting contributions that were not planned initially and that we
just integrated.

Thus, we have to rework our message and if it is now ready from the
Orange side,  we are still validating its contents with the other
companies at that moment.

I don’t think it would be fair to not include everyone.

 

Also let’s not mistake haste for speed.

In the past, these people noticed their message was modified by the
marketing and they didn’t have a chance to react to these modifications.
For example in Neon, they told me that they would have liked to change
the term “degree” which has a different meaning in WDM.

If the message was really OK for non-optical expert, it was really
confusing for the optical professionals.

I’d really like that we take the time to talk on how we can avoid this
kind of situation for future releases.

 

Best Regards

Guillaume

 

 

*De :*Daniel de la Rosa [mailto:ddelarosa0707@gmail.com]
*Envoyé :* jeudi 25 mars 2021 05:36
*À :* Casey Cain; Robert Varga; Luis Gomez; navid.ghazisaidi@verizon.com
*Cc :* LAMBERT Guillaume TGI/OLN; Brandon Wick
*Objet :* Re: Release Interview

 

Indeed we talked about it so let me add Robert so he can let us know why
this wiki page doesn't include NETCONF and other of his projects. Let me
also add Navid and Luis since we all talked about this during a TSC
meeting. 

 

On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 11:55 AM Casey Cain <ccain@linuxfoundation.org
<mailto:ccain@linuxfoundation.org>> wrote:

We discussed this at the last 2 TSC meetings and even mentioned it a
few times before.  We have an outstanding action item for the
Release Manager and the PTLs to ensure that the information on this
wiki page <https://wiki.opendaylight.org/x/GRsF> is accurate and
complete prior to March 24th.

The purpose of the Interview is to give a chance for the face of the
community, the TSC chair to provide their thoughts on the release
and to highlight important changes.

 

In the past when we tried to have the "Release Interview" with the
entire TSC we have had issues with staying on topic and developing
relevant marketing messaging.  If you think it would be best to
approach Robert to do the release interview, please let me know.

 

Best,

Casey Cain

Technical Program Manager / Community Architect

Linux Foundation

_________________

IRC: CaseyLF

WeChat: okaru6

Voice: +1.408.641.0193

Book a Meeting w/ Casey <http://calendly.com/caseylf>

 

 

On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 11:34 AM <guillaume.lambert@orange.com
<mailto:guillaume.lambert@orange.com>> wrote:

No objection.

I let you propose it at the meeting start.

 

*De :*Daniel de la Rosa [mailto:ddelarosa0707@gmail.com
<mailto:ddelarosa0707@gmail.com>]
*Envoyé :* mercredi 24 mars 2021 15:06
*À :* LAMBERT Guillaume TGI/OLN
*Cc :* Casey Cain; Brandon Wick
*Objet :* Re: Release Interview

 

Hello all. I'm not available either but also, we are going to
need Robert and potentially others since they are more fully
aware of what's new in Silicon. Maybe we can just use the whole
TSC meeting to review this?

 

Thanks

 

On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:23 AM <guillaume.lambert@orange.com
<mailto:guillaume.lambert@orange.com>> wrote:

Hi all

 

My agenda is already full this Friday afternoon ( 7am PST is
3pm Paris Time this week)

Can it wait for Monday ? Potentially anytime at your
convenience.

 

Best Regards

Guillaume

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------

*De :*Casey Cain [ccain@linuxfoundation.org
<mailto:ccain@linuxfoundation.org>]
*Envoyé :* mardi 23 mars 2021 21:32
*À :* LAMBERT Guillaume TGI/OLN; Daniel de la Rosa
*Cc :* Brandon Wick
*Objet :* Release Interview

Hi, Guillaume and Daniel.

 

As we discussed previously there is a need to confirm the
release features of Silicon and set up an interview with
yourself for marketing purposes.  Can we schedule this
interview for this Friday at 7 am PST?

I will also confirm with you on this week's TSC call that
the necessary information has already been collected and
posted to the wiki.

 

Thanks!!

Casey Cain

Technical Program Manager / Community Architect

Linux Foundation

_________________

IRC: CaseyLF

WeChat: okaru6

Voice: +1.408.641.0193

Book a Meeting w/ Casey <http://calendly.com/caseylf>

_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

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_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc

pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler

a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,

Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci.

 

This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged information that may be protected by law;

they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.

If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and delete this message and its attachments.

As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been modified, changed or falsified.

Thank you.

_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,
Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci.

This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged information that may be protected by law;
they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.
If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and delete this message and its attachments.
As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been modified, changed or falsified.
Thank you.


Anil Belur
 



On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 11:09 PM Robert Varga <nite@...> wrote:
Hello everyone,

I would also like to raise two concerns:

1) this particular conversation is point-to-point and not on mailing
list. I do not see *any* reason for it to be private, so can everyone
here *default* to mailing lists, please?

2) we are slipping more and more into *only* using meetings. There is
very little in terms of asynchronous (and public) communication going on
-- and very quickly 'on meetings' is becoming the only place where any
work is being done.

If you look at LFX, the second trend is clearly visible in graphs when
you look at on which days things tend to happen.

I am not sure what 'interview' is meant to mean here.

Honestly, as the guy who contributed 53% of changes in past 6 months and
83.5% of changes in last 90 days, I just do not have the cycles to
edit/maintain wiki pages -- this is effectively creating reports and as
such it *must* be automated. Any and all maintenance must be a natural
part of the development workflow -- i.e. things like 'which versions are
in Silicon MRI' absolutely must have a single place in Gerrit and that
place needs to be updated as part of the version bump process -- just
like
https://docs.opendaylight.org/projects/integration-distribution/en/latest/platform-versions.html
is.

I have raised the issue of our release notes templates being unusable to
pretty much everyone at least three times over the course of past three
years, yet nothing has changed.

They are useless to developers, simply because things are not tied to
anything developer-tangible. It is unusable to marketing, because it
deals with 'features' and similar technical constructs. It is useless to
our end users, as it is not tied to use cases.

Each and every single release we go through the same exercise and basics
do not change.

Per-project release notes should look something like:
https://www.eclipse.org/xtend/releasenotes.html#/releasenotes/2021/03/02/version-2-25-0
-- note how pretty much everything in that is easily scripted and automated.

The overall SimRel notes should look something like:
https://www.eclipse.org/eclipse/news/4.19/

Both of those should be created in a collaborative and open fashion and
ultimately hosted in a git repository (probably docs).

As for timing, please understand that these documents come to life at
SimRel start and *NOT* just before SimRel is released -- they need to be
*finalized* in the few weeks between code freeze and release
announcement. What that means in concrete terms is that for Silicon
these should have been started on 2020-09-17 at the latest -- and
preferably just after 2020-08-03.

Regards,
Robert

Hello Robert: 

I agree with the way release notes are managed for ODL $project might need to be changed, the versions number by themselves are meaningless without more information. 
For a while for lf-releng/global-jjb and releng/lftools repos we are managing the release notes with reno.

Examples: 

Maybe ODL projects should move to using this tool or something similar?

Cheers,
Anil